Author Topic: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...  (Read 2959 times)

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Offline Simon [aka springtide]

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I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« on: May 31, 2009, 12:28:27 AM »
A bit of a love hate relationship with the a900+CZ2470

In some ways it feels that the IQ of the a900+CZ2470 is hard to be topped on any dSLR, but on the opposing side it can be disapointing..

There's a poem that sums it up really:

There was a little girl
Who had a little curl 
Right in the middle of her forehead; 
And when she was good 
She was very, very good, 
But when she was bad she was horrid.


The a900 is very noisey in the wrong conditions.  I mean, even ISO200 can look bad at 1:1 (in the print is obviously different).  Same goes for the CZ2470 - in harsh lighting can make the bokeh appear poor.

But given the right conditions, the a900 really can shine.

Just a snap really from bedtime tonight...


LARGE@ http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2447/3578904283_566804a64f_b.jpg

And 100% crop


Not sure if my expectations are low, but for a zoom shoot wide open [f2.8], it looks pretty sharp to me :)

I have other images shot with the a900 that show the dark side, but I guess that's maybe myself not understanding how to get the most out of it.  But I can always just blame the camera I suppose :)
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Offline Bill

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2009, 12:40:32 AM »
Outstanding!

Bill
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Offline Rob aka [minolta mad]

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2009, 02:32:09 PM »
I'd be pleased with that.


Rob

Offline Stef.

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2009, 07:57:46 PM »
Simon- as I have said numerous times before the A900 is a different beast alltogether and needs a much more considerate approach. I assume that you shoot in RAW? Also- a real problem with teh A900 is the compression for webuse: there are soo many pixels that need to be thrown out as it is such a huge file that the outcomes for web don't do the A900 any justice. Once you print files from the A900 it actually really blows you away.
I love mine but would not use it for "shooting" pictures but much more for "taking images". In the studio i.e. that camera is unbeatable.
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Offline Simon [aka springtide]

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2009, 08:38:05 PM »
I am not displeased with the a900 at all, far from it.  And given the option of swapping what I have for a similar setup with a d700 I wouldn't do it, and not for the reasons of sticking with Sony and the communities.

I've been thinking about this a bit recently and personally I think the main issue is ACR and my workflow. I pretty much use LR exclusively, and output to TIFF (and then PS) if more advanced editing is required.  99% of my images come straight out of LR.

My only real issue with the a900 is the noise in the shadow areas, even at ISO200. Same photo, reasonable light, and 100% crop from the other side of the image.



Note that this image has had the exposure boosted by approx 2/3 of a stop (almost forgot, why does the a900 the majority of the time, underexpose?)

Not sure if I'm being very critical, but to me that looks like far too much noise to what I'd expect from ISO200 - but also the pattern is slightly blotchy.  What this actually reminds me of, is the a700 images when it was first released.
I was trying to think back to what actually fixed this issue on the a700, whether it was just a gradual improvement in ACR for the a700, or whether it was updates to the a700 firmware. Doesn't seem that long ago, but I can't remember ???

Obviously you'd need to print huge to see this noise, which for me means it's really a non issue in real terms, since a bit of additional PP can clean this up.

I have seen images from DXO and the noise and grain does seem much better. But to change my workflow to include a pre RAW to Post Demosaic DNG with DXO, means more hassle/time PP, more expense, and more data.

To me, owning the a900 from early(ish) release just feels a bit dayjarvoo.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2009, 08:42:41 PM by Simon [aka springtide] »
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Offline Stef.

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2009, 12:10:48 AM »
I am not sure about your workflow as I don't use Lightroom that often. But I have never found noise at ISO200???

This is a shot @ ISO800


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Offline Simon [aka springtide]

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2009, 02:10:45 PM »

I know, I know... :)  Pixel lots of pixel peeping and not enough photography!

I guess to put a bit of prespective on the noise from the 100% crop, 24" monitor displays ar roughly 90dpi, and the image size from the a900 is 6048 x 4032.  So looking at 1:1 on my 24", is like looking at a print 67" wide x 45" high.

I've printed a reasonable amount since getting the a900, and always loved the images printed - which is what counts.

So it's not a big issue, but I do feel like I've been here before when I had the a700. And looking a back at my a700 images, they were cleaner but obviously half the resolution.

As you can see from the whole image, the noise in the shadows is not visable at all.  It's only when you pixel peep that you see the noise (100% crops).  But what I find interesting, is the difference in detail within the highlights and shadows.
I know what we shouldn't pixel peep, but if we are not interested in the amount of captured detail (and noise) at the pixel level, then we are not really interested in the additional resolution the a900 gives over the a700.
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Offline MikeO

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Re: I do love the a900+CZ2470 combo (sometimes)...
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2009, 03:30:57 PM »
Here's a thought to keep in mind. If you go back a few years when the film vs digital war was in full swing, there was a lot of research done on just when digital would surpass film. The interesting thing to note here is that a) digital tended to have less noise than film and b) film had greater color accuracy. As to point b, the higher the digital pixel count, the better the color accuracy was. Thus, the additional resolution the A900 gives over the A700 should give, at least in theory, better color accuracy.

I'm not sure if anyone has bothered to look at the current crop of sensors vs film, but I do know there are still photographers out there that prefer film. If you let them play with an A900 for a while, it just might change their minds.
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